tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post7414970679196921223..comments2024-03-25T19:18:14.047-04:00Comments on What's Alan Watching?: Kings, "Goliath": The man who would be kingAlan Sepinwallhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03388147774725646742noreply@blogger.comBlogger44125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-66546378943175677592009-03-17T11:54:00.000-04:002009-03-17T11:54:00.000-04:00Nicole -- that was unquestionably a set-up with th...Nicole -- that was unquestionably a set-up with the queen. Very skillfully done, too. She keeps saying she doesn't like to get involved in politics, but I was getting Lady Macbeth-ish vibes from her the whole time.<BR/><BR/>I think the pilot was solid. I agree with whoever said that they'd watch McShane read a Cheesecake FActory menu, so I'm biased too; but I actually really liked the stylized dialogue and thought the second half, in particular, was very strong. I'll watch again.aimeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14731706747402949232noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-4393781645944138672009-03-17T03:46:00.000-04:002009-03-17T03:46:00.000-04:00The biblical David did *not* use a slingshot (a ha...The biblical David did *not* use a slingshot (a hand catapult). He used a *sling* (a pouch attached to a long cord) - much more deadly, like the difference between a BB gun and an actual rifle.<BR/><BR/>A sling in the hands of a skilled user was a cheap but effective military and hunting weapon used by most ancient armies, militias, etc. <BR/><BR/>What's the exact modern equivalent a sling? A decent high-power bolt-action rifle: like the ancient sling, a dual-use weapon suitable for either hunting (killing wolves, etc.) or use as a military weapon. <BR/><BR/>For an exact equivalent, therefore, David should have carried a sniper rifle and stopped the tank by shooting its commander when he popped the hatch. <BR/><BR/>But having him use an anti-tank rocket worked reasonably well.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-51142141726503244662009-03-17T02:33:00.000-04:002009-03-17T02:33:00.000-04:00Do they have the Bible in their world, and the sto...<I>Do they have the Bible in their world, and the story of Saul and David? If so, would somebody see the similarity to Silas and Shepherd?</I><BR/><BR/>No, actually the whole thinng is taking place inside a snow globe.<BR/><BR/>Ephram is a non-Jewish name? Really?<BR/>I think, to me, the girl who was not named Debra cause it was "a Jewish name"<BR/>- maybe it's the intervening 50 years. Saul is the only name in the bunch (except for Ephraim) that sounds "Jewish" to me. And even that may be due to Brothers & Sisters (granted, I've never met one person named Saul - but the boy I crushed on in 3rd & 10thh grades was named Abraham. Avi for short, and had sisters Sharon (not so Jewish, to me) and Miriam (now that sounds Jewish to me), his other siblings - David and Clara and one other brother named George - that one, I have no idea where it came from.<BR/><BR/>The butterflies were pretty... I thought the anointing was in the garage myself. <BR/><BR/>I apologize for not reading enough comments to get what Queen Mom was doing.<BR/><BR/>I find war intensely boring (my brother made me read two Tom Clancy novels just cause I asked him What do you mean "President" Jack Ryan? (and I never even saw the movies. I knew he wasn't President in them though.))<BR/><BR/>Silly me - for the past 30 years, I've been thinking that Saul was almost as young as David when he was chosen to be king. Today I read in (whichever book it's in) that *Jonathan* was old enough to be leading armies 2 years after Dad was crowned. I think I may have read way too much into "small in his own eyes."<BR/><BR/>As for the Jewish factor, how many people in this story would actually be Jewish? David and his family for sure. Saul was of the tribe of Benjamin (no, I didn't remember, I read it). Is there an exemption for Benjamites as they split off with Judah later on? I can't even remember if they are the ones who did. It's been a long time - and I was reading all the little purple You Are There boxes scattered amidst the two or three chapters I managed to read - which were mostly Samuel finding Saul and anointing him and possibly one battle. I could use a few more "tomatoes on the windowsill" - I'm the one who saw the Three Stories episode of House and didn't even blink when House went from his bed to the staircase or outside a Taco stand - I didn't think it was a dream, I didn't think he was using a transporter - I just thought it was the next scene.I tend to just not think about the things I don't see. I guess it's better to see them (tons of troops with (in this case) tanks. Unfortunately I still find it as boring as a list of begats.<BR/><BR/>Okay, anyone still here can wake up now.<BR/><BR/>The second half (or 3rd third) was less boring than the beginning.<BR/>The comments helped some, but not having looked up the actors names (my fault) added some confusion too.<BR/>Note to self: read with imdb in another window cause you're having the same problem with DollhousePamela Jayehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06135379188588301400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-6702157109727086092009-03-17T01:15:00.000-04:002009-03-17T01:15:00.000-04:00I'm wondering if we're to assume that this world w...I'm wondering if we're to assume that this world was the same as ours up to a point in time as the world of 'West Wing' was, or is it supposed to be different right from the get-go?<BR/><BR/>There was mention of Liszt and that piece he wrote in 1848 (I looked that up - that was the beginning of his time under the patronage of the Duke of Weimar.), so we know our historical characters existed in their world.<BR/><BR/>But would this world have all of the same details as our world, down to something as major as Judaism? (Considering the remarks I saw about there not being enough Jewish characters, I wonder if they even have the same religions we do, or some equivalent?)<BR/><BR/>Do they have the Bible in their world, and the story of Saul and David? If so, would somebody see the similarity to Silas and Shepherd?<BR/><BR/>I'm thinking that even if they do have the same historical characters, there was some kind of major upheaval in the way the world evolved. Gath is north of Gilboa, which looks and feels like America, but the front lines are in a desert region.....<BR/><BR/>I hope these get addressed in future episodes, because the idea of a new world is what brought me to check out 'Kings'.Toby O'Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06999037844031101965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-64178811965814176862009-03-17T00:10:00.000-04:002009-03-17T00:10:00.000-04:00Oh, and it wasn't a grenade that destroyed the Gol...Oh, and it wasn't a grenade that destroyed the Goliath, that was just a distraction to let David get away so he could blow it up with a Javelin anti-tank missle (or whatever the show's equivalent would be). So the Javelin is the slingshot?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-11895132653557205632009-03-17T00:08:00.000-04:002009-03-17T00:08:00.000-04:00My biggest problem was the lengths they went to ma...My biggest problem was the lengths they went to make the analogy between Biblical battles and modern day battles. Those scenes on the battlefront were hopelessly confusing from a modern military POV. Who does trench warfare nowadays? Who sits tanks out in the open like that and why wouldn't they be decimated by artillery and air support? Who houses strategically important POWs 500 yards from the enemy lines? Tortured logic like this is a real distraction for me. If you can't make it work within the context of the story, than abstract the details rather than expose the ridiculousness of it.<BR/><BR/>Compare this to BSG, which tends to handle military situations and tactics far more (if not completely) realistically (and it's frakkin scifi).<BR/><BR/>I was satisfied with most of the rest of the show and think the political manipulations and intricacies could be quite interesting, though a bit more over the top then West Wing or BSG. If they can hold in the Bibilical themes without being so blatantly forced, this could be a decent show.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-11303620127281787822009-03-16T18:38:00.000-04:002009-03-16T18:38:00.000-04:00@rks- I think that David was actually anointed by ...@rks- I think that David was actually anointed by Rev. Samuel with the "you have something on your head"-motor oil?- move which would have been in keeping with the biblical story. I took that as the beginning of his being chosen by God.<BR/><BR/>Also, I could not agree more about the ease with which other worlds are accepted in my mind. It is far easier and much more satisfying for me to live in a world where dedicated spies work at the Buy More and Zen police officers patrol my streets than it is to co-habit a planet with the Housewives of Orange County and Bret Michaels. Now THAT'S unreal!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-19621382657022990242009-03-16T17:53:00.000-04:002009-03-16T17:53:00.000-04:00I felt the whole thing was too rushed and that the...I felt the whole thing was too rushed and that the first two hours could have been an entire season. <BR/><BR/>Within the first 20 minutes David went from small town mechanic, to war hero, to hanging out at the royal palace. I felt it didn't provide enough time for character development and and even at the end I still didn't care what happened to any of the characters (except for Ian McShane since he's the reason I watched)<BR/><BR/>What should he have used to kill Goliath?<BR/>In the Bible David used a slingshot because that was the "tool" he used in his previous profession as a shepherd to protect his sheep. In this, when he picked up the wrench, I though he was going to take out the tank by using his mechanic skills and sneak under the tank and disable it.Jerryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16684166192923300116noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-5569923890662811372009-03-16T17:36:00.000-04:002009-03-16T17:36:00.000-04:00Jesus Christ that was boring and pointless.Jesus Christ that was boring and pointless.dark tylerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13461345493748899275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-82103684297847025122009-03-16T16:25:00.000-04:002009-03-16T16:25:00.000-04:00Wow six million viewers for its premiere episode? ...Wow six million viewers for its premiere episode? That is bad. Didn't Friday Night Lights have better opening night ratings? And this show won't have half the critical acclaim. I don't understand who at NBC thought that this show would survive network audiences. A show like this begs for HBO. Hell the Sci-fi channel if it's lucky. It's shame too because Ian McShane was really rocking the Al-like Silas.sedeyushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02189774136494238845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-54924155033990953852009-03-16T15:09:00.001-04:002009-03-16T15:09:00.001-04:00I've heard the interpretation of Jonathan being ga...I've heard the interpretation of Jonathan being gay, but I don't find that particularly interesting in this re-imagining (especially since it sounds like it's going to be every hackneyed cliche associated with a character for whom his/her family disapproves of his/her sexual orientation. I would actually prefer to see Jack and David become friends for whom blood is thicker than water, especially since I remember most of David's brothers being assholes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-29397281781681533342009-03-16T15:09:00.000-04:002009-03-16T15:09:00.000-04:00Except that Saul had a daughter named Michal, who ...<I>Except that Saul had a daughter named Michal, who wound up marrying David.</I><BR/><BR/>That's a point. Perhaps they've combined the roles of the Biblical Jonathan and his sister Michal since it would be difficult to recreate the masculine intimacy of the Biblical relationship between David and Jonathan without it being interpreted within the modern discursive constructs of sexuality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-55273887288563992212009-03-16T14:15:00.000-04:002009-03-16T14:15:00.000-04:00The Biblical Jonathon would seem to correspond to ...<I>The Biblical Jonathon would seem to correspond to Jack's sister, Michelle.</I><BR/><BR/>Except that Saul had a daughter named Michal, who wound up marrying David.Alan Sepinwallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03388147774725646742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-83732721887976244652009-03-16T14:11:00.000-04:002009-03-16T14:11:00.000-04:00I don't know why it's relevant to interpret Biblic...I don't know why it's relevant to interpret Biblical events with the 19-21st century (hopefully this is it's last century) social construct of "homosexuality" but in any case Jack is not Jonathon, who loved David when they first met ("the soul of Jonathan was bound to the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul"). The Biblical Jonathon would seem to correspond to Jack's sister, Michelle. It appears they are setting the "gay" Jack up as, if not a bad guy, then manipulated into evil doings because of his "sexuality" and his and his father's reaction to it. The love "passing the love of women" replaced by guilty affairs with "boys." The gay mafia will likely not be happy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-78615557219861107702009-03-16T13:44:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:44:00.000-04:00Thanks, Oaktown Girl. Admittedly, I'm kinda obsess...Thanks, Oaktown Girl. Admittedly, I'm kinda obsessive when it comes to Deadwood, so I may find more parallels than there actually are. Speaking of which, I realize that the language is difficult at times, and certainly different than anything else on TV right now, but I barely noticed.<BR/><BR/>Bad news about the ratings, as this show had clearly chosen to take time it may not have.Hatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01184680741873873714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-9191316845793140192009-03-16T13:43:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:43:00.000-04:00That sounds plausible, RAP.That sounds plausible, RAP.Otto Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14051682366565874144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-34833842177807339572009-03-16T13:41:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:41:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Hatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01184680741873873714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-47667589827410115012009-03-16T13:32:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:32:00.000-04:00That's bad news about the ratings. As I was watchi...That's bad news about the ratings. As I was watching the first hour, I was worried that the pacing might be too slow for many people.<BR/> <BR/>Nicole - excellent point about the King's daughter. I hope it's not the case that all her caring for the have-nots was simply a case of not having a man in her life. Besides, from a plot perspective, it will be much more interesting (and realistic) if she continues being a strong activist.<BR/><BR/>To clarify my earlier comment about the Queen - it's clear she is cunning and a major political player, I just wish she'd had more screen time in this first episode.<BR/><BR/><I>Any other DeadwoodHeads think of Al smacking Johnny Burns around when the messenger told Silas it was his son that was held hostage?</I> <BR/>Good one, Hatfield.Oaktown Girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00811331454878606058noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-4670639711995941362009-03-16T13:12:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:12:00.000-04:00@Otto Man, Actually, I believe the queen just held...@Otto Man, Actually, I believe the queen just held on to the phone for a few days, making a big deal of it, then planted it with her assistant's bra in the back of Jack's car. The assistant seemed genuinely shocked at first, then understood she'd been used.R.A. Porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851961356321735388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-27788602328375778942009-03-16T13:09:00.000-04:002009-03-16T13:09:00.000-04:00What was the deal with the cellphone?The queen han...<I>What was the deal with the cellphone?</I><BR/><BR/>The queen handed it to her assistant like she'd thought, as shown by the fact that the assistant's bra turned up with the phone in her son's car.<BR/><BR/>All of this seemed to be an elaborate move by the queen to authenticate her son's heterosexuality. The big reveal about the bra and the cell being found happens in front of the press, and she lets them run with the story as long as they make Jack seem "a little rakish."Otto Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14051682366565874144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-54776370115546274792009-03-16T12:38:00.000-04:002009-03-16T12:38:00.000-04:00Jack being gay seems to match what I remember of t...<I>Jack being gay seems to match what I remember of the Talmudic interpretation that David and Saul's son Jonathan were more than just close friends during David's time in exile?</I><BR/><BR/>Nope.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-35022716445810415842009-03-16T11:55:00.000-04:002009-03-16T11:55:00.000-04:00They seem to have changed any of the names that se...They seem to have changed any of the names that seem vaguely Jewish: Saul to Silas, Jonathan to Jack, Samuel to Ephram Samuals, etc. I guess they figured the subject matter would be an uphill climb for attracting viewers without making people think it was "that Jewish show."<BR/><BR/>And, based on last night's ratings, they would be right about the uphill climb part. A distant fourth place in every half-hour in the 18-49 demo, and it lost viewers every half hour.Alan Sepinwallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03388147774725646742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-56608937522720837092009-03-16T11:52:00.000-04:002009-03-16T11:52:00.000-04:00did someone *say* that they were all Jews? I don&#...did someone *say* that they were all Jews? I don't recall even Israel being spoken. The (allegorical?) land is Gilboa I think.<BR/><BR/>Michelle was somewhat interesting but I didn't like Jack at all and I would have preferred to like David (why didn't they change his name too?) more.<BR/>What was the deal with the cellphone?<BR/>I did like the Reverend, and and curious about the butterflies.<BR/><BR/>I stopped in the middle to ease my boredom with Brothers & Sisters.Pamela Jayehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06135379188588301400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-44472544947334690072009-03-16T11:35:00.000-04:002009-03-16T11:35:00.000-04:00Good point R.A. - and you're right that could be a...Good point R.A. - and you're right that could be a problem esp if they start trying to please everybody.<BR/><BR/>Hey - I just went to IMDB to check on the actor that played Rev Samuel and he's not listed - anybody know why? (turns out it's Eamonn Walker)Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06336003200003462670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17517257.post-10896465726389917122009-03-16T11:33:00.000-04:002009-03-16T11:33:00.000-04:00Similar to something said above, I'd listen to McS...Similar to something said above, I'd listen to McShane read the menu at Cheesecake Factory if they aired it on television, so maybe I'm a bit biased. That said, I really dug this. Yeah, it was slow, but I appreciated that it took its time, even if occasionally it took too much. The rest of the cast seems strong as well, even Egan, whom I think is getting unfairly blasted by everyone. Not that it was Emmy-winning or anything, but I bought his awkwardness as part of his character. Even his speech (yeah, I agree, how the hell did anyone hear him, but then again, Silas and Geronimo seemed to know what he was doing), and especially his scenes with McShane and when Eli was dying.<BR/><BR/>A couple other things:<BR/><BR/>- Any other DeadwoodHeads think of Al smacking Johnny Burns around when the messenger told Silas it was his son that was held hostage?<BR/><BR/>- I liked Eamonn Walker, and I hope he gets more to do soon.<BR/><BR/>- Jack was well-played, I thought, as the right mix of entitled, spoiled, resentful and self-loathing.<BR/><BR/>- How cute was McShane with his secret family? His giggling with his kid was the kind of thing I've never seen him do, and it made me smile.<BR/><BR/>- Does Marlyne Afflack being cast mean she'll be making a power play at some point?<BR/><BR/>This type of slowly-unveiled mythology-driven narrative always appeals to me, so sorry if I went on and on. I hope it gets a chance to tell its tale.Hatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01184680741873873714noreply@blogger.com